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For over a decade, David Tian, Ph.D. — a uniquely qualified therapist, life coach, and former university professor — has coached tens of thousands of people from over 87 countries to achieve happiness and success in their relationships, dating, psychology, and lifestyle.
Dr. Tian has been featured in international media, as well as co-hosting a radio show on national radio and a weekly dating advice column in a national newspaper in Singapore.
The show, “Man Up: Masculinity for the Intelligent Man” (https://www.davidtianphd.com/blog/), is David’s way of helping as many people as possible enjoy empowering and fulfilling lives, while contributing to the global understanding of masculinity in modern times. In the show, he takes your questions posed in the Man Up private Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/manupcommunity/) and answers based on his experience coaching tens of thousands of students around the world for over a decade.
Connect with David Tian here:
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The Reality of Women, Sex, and Relationships According to Science
David Tian Ph.D. addresses some relationships and dating problems men face today.
David Tian Ph.D. explains the issues through evolutionary psychology.
In order to be better in relationships, David Tian Ph.D. emphasizes the need to understand the different nuances of love.
David Tian Ph.D. debunks the troubadour myth, the myth of true love as being just passion, and passion only.
In this talk, David Tian Ph.D. lays down what makes a relationship successful.
David Tian: Welcome! I’m David Tian, Ph.D., and for over the past 10 years, I’ve been helping hundreds of thousands of people in over 87 countries attain success, happiness and fulfillment in life and love.
Welcome, guys. I had to give the intro for the video. The talk here is titled The Secret Scientific Findings About Sex, Love, and the Brain That Society Doesn’t Want You To Know. I’m not sure if we’ll use this as far as SEO goes, but it’s fun to use.
I gave this talk originally at some universities. They use this in their posters, and they brought lots of students to these things, so I give it as part of some keynote talks.
Why are we talking about this? There are two particular problems that this talk is addressing. One group of guys falls in love really easily, maybe because it’s their first love, or they are ‘innocent’ guys, they are nice guys with no or very little sexual experience, and very little relationship experience beyond lovey-dovey Disney kind of stuff.
And then they get their heart broken, and they keep going in that way. They are naive guys and they just keep wondering, sort of like you often hear girls wondering, “Why can’t I find love?” Seeking love, and things like that.
And then there’s another group of guys which is an offshoot from that group that I’m concerned with. One reaction is to give up the naiveté and swing the completely other direction, which you see a lot of nowadays.
I’ll cite for you the Red Pill subculture, the MGTOW subculture – Men Go Their Own Way subculture, which is basically saying they have this naiveté, this Disney fantasy of love just like every young person does. It’s an illusion, right? So they are like, “Oh shit, this girl cheated on me, manipulated me, lied to me.” Or it could’ve just been as simple as the love faded away, and she left me, and I’m heartbroken.
And that first love for a needy guy is one of the most devastating experiences ever, especially if you’re still in your teenage years. So he’s like, “Ah, fuck it.” But usually if he’s a teenager, he’s still going to hold on to the naiveté, and the hope, and continue trying again and again.
But the guys in their 30s, especially if you’ve discovered ‘game’ in your late 20s or later, you don’t got that much time to get into lovey-dovey relationships, plus the women that you are meeting are going to be a lot more experienced than you, if you’re in your late 20s getting into game, dating women around your age.
And they’ll be more cynical, a lot more experienced. And what’ll happen is, guys find out, “Oh man, she’s a slut.” That girl’s date, man, I thought she was pure like my mom but she’s a slut. I thought she was pure like my sisters, my mom, but she’s a slut.
After two or three of those they go, “Fuck man, all girls are sluts. Be careful of women, the evil feminists, the evil females.” And on the face you can’t say that in society, and so they go on the internet, the wimps go on the internet. Real men speak to me in person, the wimps talk to me over the internet.
So then they go the other way completely and they hate all women, but in a way where they love the sex, they love the physical body, but they hate what they think that woman is like.
And what happens when you prime? You can prime yourself to think things, if you suggest things in the beginning, you prime yourself. You prime relationships, you prime other people. And when you walk into a relationship or an interaction assuming she’s a slut, you’re going to get that negative energy coming back at you.
Have you been in that situation where you have been hurt by a woman, or you’re in a relationship that you don’t understand how to rekindle the passion? You thought all you needed to do was get into that relationship.
Once you’re in it, you’re scot-free, all the hard work is done. Man, getting married, that’s the hard work, right? Now, I can rest. I’m married. I don’t need to work out. I don’t need to hang out with my guy friends. I can focus on my career. Modern world is like that, modern dudes. “I’m going to make money now because I’ve got my girl!”
They put that woman, that wife, on the shelf, like “Checkmark”, they’ve got a list of things they got to do: six pack, wife, got the wife. Right? Fuck the six pack now, I’ve got the wife. What’s the six pack for? Who cares? Give me some beer and donuts, right? And then they can focus on making money because they mistakenly think that also will bring them happiness or significance.
So then of course, the relationship falls apart. They don’t know why and even if you didn’t neglect the relationship, even if you did all the dating stuff, and you did what everyone else is doing, you didn’t purposely neglect it to pursue money or something like that, it still would fail.
They don’t understand why because they don’t know the science of it. That’s what this talk is about: is to help you understand what the science tells us about female psychology in dating and relationships.
Female psychology around the issues or the topics of sex, of sexual attraction, and how to make a relationship work over the long run; the science of it, not the shit that your buddies tell you over beer, or your females friends tell you over TWG tea or some shit. TWG is a reference that will be picked up outside this area.
What the science tells us. We’re going to be drawing from evolutionary psychology. I’m going to be assuming a lot of knowledge on that, as well as the newer fields of neuropsychology and sexology. Neuropsychology is a cross-disciplinary field of neuroscience and psychology, and the offshoot or smaller field of sexology coming out of neuropsychology, the study of the psychology and science of sex. I didn’t know that was an option when I started school. I picked the wrong major, you know what I mean?
Practical implications and applications, of course all along the way of each of these. Let’s dive into it. I got quite a lot to cover here.
The modern dilemma of love. These images, I randomly Google stuff that the slide is about, find images to keep your attention. But they’re not all like that, but this one is. This is the 50 year birthday of Singapore, it’s a cake. Okay, the modern dilemma of love. Women and men, especially women who want their cake and eat it too.
In other words, women who want to have the lovey-dovey, Hollywood, Disney romance, ride off into the sunset with Prince Charming life. But then they want to fuck a lot of hot dudes, and they want to party, they want to go crazy and be wild, and they want to experience what it’s like to just see the world and be free.
They want both. They want to be in a monogamous relationship that’s loving, with kids, and a family, white picket fence, riding off in the sunset with Prince Charming, and then they want to have the wild nights with girls of Sex in the City.
That’s the modern dilemma of love. If you’ve ever experienced that, what I’ve just described there are two different types of relationships. One is a passionate type of attraction, one where it’s wild, crazy, and lots of fun, free love. Let’s just hook up and not think about the consequences or anything like that, and just hook up and have fun. Totally down for that, have done that.
And then the companionate love of “Let’s ride off into the sunset together and live together until we are old and die.” The modern dilemma results in 60% higher divorce rates, because what’s happening is people don’t realize that it is a dilemma; that they can’t make that transition from the passionate attraction that they had with that guy that was just hot and sexy, and trying to transition into the long-term Disney love affair. Psychologists explain or chart this out in this way. This is a very simple chart. I think I took this Figure 6.2 from Jonathan Haidt’s book Happiness Hypothesis, very highly recommended.
On the X-axis here, you have time, and the Y-axis is intensity. The darker line is companionate attraction or companionate love, and then this dotted line, which spikes up immediately and then quickly dives down is passionate attraction. It never goes back up.
This is the common view of the interaction between these two types of attraction over time in clinical psychology. And I think actually – you see how that companionate attraction line flat lines and plateaus there. I don’t think that’s necessarily the case. It can continue to go up, but it’s a gentle curve up.
The tricky part is most people just get into a passionate relationship in the modern world, with modern Western – and I would have to classify Singapore under the term of Western, especially Zouk having their big thing tonight. I mean, the first club I went to here in Singapore was Zouk and it was like – everyone was telling me, “Oh, it’s so conservative.” I go in there and I see people making out everywhere. I see hookups happening. This shit ain’t conservative, you know what I mean? That’s like saying KL is conservative.
KL is conservative except in Zouk. There’s a lot of people doing some nasty. So what happens is it goes down to trying to transition, to make the long-term relationship work, and they never make that transition. They just experience this, and they’re like, “This sucks!” and break up. I’m going to get into why that’s so. And one of the reasons why that’s so is because of the change in global life expectancy. Thank you very much for technology and science, it has helped us to live longer, more miserable lives.
What happened was – this line should be sort of like this, 20 to 30. This is expectancy. Expectancy is different from span. I’m a student of history. My PhD was in 8th century Chinese religious philosophy and psychology.
Back then even, there were Chinese scholars who lived until the ’70s. There were quite a few elites who could live that long because they led a life of relative luxury and ease. But the average person succumbed to disease, hunger, or whatever it was, or they got killed, eaten, or something like that. So expectancy was quite low.
And right up until World War II, expectancy was still low, because it was called a World War. I think life expectancy in Asia was still pretty low until the ’70s because we still had the Korean War, and there’s a lot of wars going on in Asia-Pacific. That spike up is relatively recent.
And then with the technological advances, you see it go a lot higher. One of the biggest ones was anesthesia, and the understanding around germs and bacteria. People thought beer was the drink of the gods, I still think it is, but probably it was because you could drink it and not die. Whereas if you drink the water, you would die, because of all the shit in the water, because they boiled the water to make the beer. Interesting thing.
Some of the best beer is made in Belgium by a recipe made by the monks in the 1400s. It was like the one drink you could have and not die. It was a pretty good time back then. I think everyone was drunk like fuck back then. Like, “I need some water!”, give me some beer. I wonder if they were giving babies beer because it’s the only safe drink.
Here is another reason. This is Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet. When I was going through high school, this was the version we watched. You probably watched the Leonardo DiCaprio version. This was the one we watched, and there’s a great quotation in Jonathan Haidt’s book, Happiness Hypothesis, to explain why we hold on to this notion of love. Not just women, that’s the most common caricature of women, always want to fall in love, but men too.
Every man starts out believing in love because it’s natural, normal, and it’s good. But along the way, they get taught random shit like ‘toughen up’, or they get hurt like I was saying at the beginning.
They become bitter and they go the red pill. But underlying all of that is still this need to find love. And one of the things that I’m going to be doing in this talk is speaking to two different groups.
I will sort of be talking to the red pill people along the way. But when I designed the talk, it was originally for all the naive motherfuckers in Asia because the red pill ain’t in Asia.
The naive guys who are 30 years old in their first relationship. I know. It’s crazy, right? I work with a lot of 40 year old virgins. It’s their first relationship and they are looking to create that love relationship that they watched in the movies. “Why can’t I have that? I worked so hard at math. I deserve love.” They don’t actually think they deserve it, but they want it. And I’m just going to read out this quotation, it’s great.
“The troubadours did give us a particular myth of ‘true’ love.” True love, okay? “The idea that real love burns brightly and passionately, and then it just keeps on burning until death, and then it just keeps on burning after death as the lovers are reunited in heaven. This myth seems to have grown and diffused in modern times into a set of interrelated ideas about love and marriage.
As I see it, the modern myth of true love involves these beliefs. One, true love is passionate love that never fades. Two, if you are in ‘true love’, you should marry that person. Three, if love ends, you should leave that person because then it was not true love. Four, and if you can find the right person, you will have true love forever.”
“You might not believe this myth yourself, particularly if you are older than 30, but many young people are raised on it and it acts as an ideal that they unconsciously carry with them even if they scoff at it. But if true love is defined as eternal passion, it is biologically impossible”, a quotation from Haidt’s book, Happiness Hypothesis.
This idea of passion being required for true love as a marker, as the symbol, as the symptom or the sign that it is necessary and sufficient for true love is what causes this dilemma; not being able to see clearly how companionate attraction is different from passionate. Here is a great illustration of that: arranged marriages. I randomly found an Indian arranged marriage here. Well, I typed in ‘arranged marriage’. I have no idea if this is arranged or not, but there’s a study in 2012, Cal State study, and other studies around arranged marriages.
And this particular study looked at couples who are in arranged marriages residing in the US, and found that their happiness or subjective well-being, their reported happiness, was the same or higher than couples who are in love marriages. And guess what? Throughout human history, our ancestors were a product of this. Well, I shouldn’t point at this particular photo, but a product of arranged marriages. Before the 1900s, marriage was basically an alliance of families. It was what you did when you came of age and had to procreate. You do that within certain social structures.
It was not about love, that’s why actually – going back to this – Romeo and Juliet at that time was so scandalous. Now modern people, we read it in high school as like, “Oh, a story of true love! A couple so in love, they said fuck you to the world and died together.” Actually, they died really stupidly. This is like a warning, “Don’t be doing this shit, you dumbass people. It’s okay to go fuck around when you’re a teenager, but when it’s time to get married, you go and get married with the guy that your parents set you up with.” Right? “So stop fucking around. You can fuck around when you’re a teenager, but now you’re an adult. You gotta make some babies for us.”
So these two said, “Fuck you”, to all of them, and then they died really stupidly. It’s a warning, man. But we look at it like, “Wow, that’s so romantic. I want that. I want to kill myself thinking he’s dead, but he’s really alive so he kills himself too.” Dumbass teenagers, right? But that’s the history, we’ve totally looked at it from a different perspective now. Now we valorize that shit. So the history actually goes, and you should know this from science. If you’ve read any behavioral economics or any social psychology, you know about the adaptation principle.
You know that once your brain says, “Oh well, these conditions are not changeable”, you fucking start to adjust. If you are the average person, you will adjust. In fact, even if the conditions are really good, you adjust down. If you win a lottery, all of a sudden you come up with all of this money, six months later you spend all of that shit and you might be even more miserable than you started.
But you’ll go back to baseline. And if you were originally really happy like that movie, the Italian one, Life is Beautiful, and then some really bad shit happens, like you become quadriplegic, or like in the movie, the Nazis roll in and start killing everybody, you go back after a while to your baseline happiness as well. You go up.
The adaptation principle says whatever conditions we have, we start to adapt as human beings. That’s just a normal thing. When you say, “Well, I’m getting married to that girl, or that guy. I guess there’s nothing I can do about it.” You start to look for ways to make it happen. If you were miserable at the beginning, you’ll have a fucking miserable relationship, yes.
But if you’re a happy dude at the beginning, you’d find ways to make it happen. You’d find the positive. So it’s still about you. It’s got nothing to do with the actual marriage. The amazing thing is we go through so much turmoil now because we have to choose.
This is an interesting thing, the paradox of choice. Now, we have all of these options: Tinder, “Oh, which one do I fuck tonight?” Now, we can’t settle. We take that one and then we go, “Oh, look at that one. Maybe that one is better.” And you put down that donut and you try the other donut. You’re in a buffet that never ends. You just keep walking and that buffet keeps going, and you’re like, “When do I stop? When do I go back to my table? I don’t know.”
Whereas before, you sat down, they served you something, and you got no choice. It’s like you’re in the mess hall of jail or whatever, “Okay, I gotta eat this.” And you just move on with your life. Another example in this context, this is China, it’s the same thing all the way through; arranged marriages. Often, you don’t even see who you are going to marry until your wedding day. So now, we move to love, because we’re just all about love. We got to get back to love.
My point about the arranged marriages is, what happens first is they get into the relationship and then they create love. We’re trying to do the opposite. We’re looking for true love, we’re seeking love. How do we know when we got it? Oh, when there’s passion.
When the passion fades, oh, I guess it wasn’t love. Oh, I guess I picked wrongly. I saw wrongly. Instead of realizing that love comes and goes, love is controllable, love is something you can use, that you can give to yourself, that you can manipulate and control within your own control.
You can use it when you need it, sometimes you have to understand the different nuances of love. In the ancient tradition of Greek philosophy, there are three types of love: eros, philia, and agape. Hopefully, you know what those mean. Eros is a lust, a passionate, intense desire.
That’s what most young people confuse with being all of love. But then I remind them, “Hey, your mom loves you. I hope she doesn’t want to fuck you.” There are other kinds of love. We use the English word in very capacious ways.
There’s philia. Philia is brotherly love, phileo, between brothers, friends. And then there’s agape, self-sacrificial love. The best view of this is the self-sacrificial love of Christ for His people. Agape could also be if you love your child so much, you would sacrifice your life to save theirs.
That would be a kind of agape. On top of that, Christian theology and Christian philosophy added another big category called storge, affection. Well, I think just translating it as affection helps you understand what that means.
I just realized those lights down the middle are off. Let’s get some light here. Okay, storge. C.S. Lewis has another way of parsing love, but I’m going to skip that. What’s important for you guys to understand is the difference between eros, this passionate, intense desire, and venus, which is this raw sexuality.
A lot of young people are confused by those two, eros and venus, and they conflate them. You can have the raw sexuality of it without being in love. I think guys understand that a little bit easier than women.
But most importantly, when you see that there are many different kinds of love, that eros in and of itself, if you just had a relationship that was just passion, then there’s not really the kind of love – there’s not the love that will sustain a long-term relationship. Passionate, intense desire comes and goes, especially after you orgasm and it’s over.
You just want to clean up. You come and go, it’s done. So if you’re just depending on that shit to pull you through, scientifically, philosophically, humanistically, it is over. That’s not love. That’s just one kind of love, that’s just one part of love.
A successful relationship requires all four kinds of love. It requires eros, and that’s the one that often goes away over time, but it also requires friendship, a friendship love; it requires self-sacrificial love, where you put the needs of your partner above your own.
And then all these red pill guys, I’m going to speak to them now, are like, “Fuck that! Just care about yourself. Just take care of number one! And as long as you take care of your number one, you’re good.” Well, that’s a horrible relationship.
That’s called slavery or indentured servitude. In a loving relationship over time, both parties will place the other party’s needs above their own at times, and that’s just an important part of it.
And if it’s mutual, then everyone’s taken care of. You take care of yourself, of course, to stay attractive, but you put her needs ahead of yours as well. She puts your needs ahead of hers, and you got a great relationship. But you got to be very, very careful who you get into love relationships with.
All of these red pill guys have gotten into relationships with the wrong woman. 90% or more of success in long-term relationships is selection. It’s like hiring for your company. 90% of success, and that’s just, “Did you pick the right person?” It’s the selection.
It’s this hubristic thing that guys who get into game think they can do everything. The sales letter is all about, “Get any woman, anytime, anywhere. Learn the four questions to get into any girl’s pants, which I will reveal to you after you look at this goldfish.” They start believing this.
And then they go into clubs, and because the clubs are very selected type of women, they get responses from those low self-esteem women, or those women that they don’t understand are low self-esteem, and they start thinking, “Oh, I can do this on every woman.”
And then those women starts to all turn out like sluts and everything, and then they’re like, “Oh, fuck them all.” Well, you had the wrong sample, and you gave it to the wrong person. Selection is everything. So, I did a free course in the Man Up primer on issue relationship material, where I go over what a lot of guys think are required for having a happy relationship like, “Oh, she likes video games too” or “She likes beer.” None of that shit matters, really. It’s good to have commonalities, but what really matters, I cover in the free video course so make sure you watch that, before you watch this, to know what selection is all about.
You have to choose the right person before you apply your love to them, before you open up. One other thing I want to say about love before I move to the next slide, is that love – so you understand it – Oh, and one other thing is love is storge, affection. And the worst is when passion goes away, so now I’m going back to the naive guys. Passion goes away, and what are you left with? A friend that you have affection for that you feel really guilty about leaving. That’s what most long-term relationships end up becoming. They are missing eros.
But eros is just one component. Once you understand this, you see that love is an action, it’s not just a feeling. So many of these guys, like the myth that I was referring to earlier, was about the troubadour myth; the myth of true love as being just passion, and passion only. That’s just not the case. That can’t be the case. And the most canonical theories of love, like for instance in the Bible, where Jesus enjoins his disciples, or everyone, to love your neighbor as yourself.
He doesn’t mean like, “Oh, there’s my neighbor. God, yeah, my neighbor!” He’s not saying like have raw, passionate, intense desire for your neighbor. He’s not saying that shit. He’s not even saying have affection for your neighbor, he’s not even saying have any feelings at all for your neighbor. If you see a homeless, crazy man but he’s starving, you don’t go, “Oh, poor homeless man.” You don’t have to. You could, it’s great if you have the feelings, but you don’t have to.
What he means is, when he says ‘love your neighbor as yourself’, go and give that motherfucker some food. Treat him in a certain way. Act towards him in a certain way. Behave towards him in a certain way. Love as an action, not a feeling. The only way a long-term relationship can be sustained is when you do it even though you don’t feel it. And you know about the power physiology; when you start to do it, it’ll be a biofeedback loop to your brain that says, “Oh, I guess I’m feeling it now.”
Have you ever worked your way into love? Yeah, you have. All you gotta do is invest. Have you ever become needy? Yes, you have. Here’s the easiest way to become needy towards anyone. Give them lots and lots of stuff without receiving anything from them or asking anything from them, have it completely one-sided. You will be attached. Here’s another way. Go to the MBS Casino, put down 1,000 dollars in every hand. Will you feel needy towards the outcome of that game? Obviously.
An easy way to actually create the feeling of love, attachment, what modern people mistakenly consider to be all that love is, “Oh, I need her so much! I miss her.” Just invest. Just fucking overinvest. It’s so easy. What Christ was saying when he says ‘love your neighbor’, is to treat your neighbor. This is the example of the Samaritan, is to behave towards your neighbor in a loving way.
That’s when love comes apart from just the feeling. Love is primarily defined us behavior. It’s one thing to say, “Oh, I love him, but I’m going to go fuck all of these other guys, and I’m going to go all of these other stuff.” She don’t fucking love you, she’s confused.
Now, we move into neediness. Why do we need love so badly? Why? Why do we seek love so much from our parents? Why? Why do we seek love from women? Why do we even need this thing called love? Why do we need it? We just assume that it’s a good thing. Why?
There are a lot of red pill dudes who are like, “Well, fuck that love. I’m going to be a man of myself. I’m going to work out, make a lot of money, I’m going to live like Dan-fucking-Bilzerian and I’ll die like that.”
They don’t fucking care, they don’t need love. I’ll tell you what, though: They do, and it’s sad. Now sometimes, right now, it’s just like an alcoholic on his binge. He don’t need it right then. He’s having a great time. He’s high in the alcohol, it’s good.
But when he hits that bend, when he comes off the bender and he hits that wall, next morning he will feel like shit, and he will feel guilty on top of feeling like shit. And all of the other bad feelings, and then he’ll have to comfort himself. He’ll have to drink again. That’s what I see the guys who deny this aspect of himself without understanding it.
It all starts when we are babies. I need to go through this a lot quicker than I would like, because I’m trying to keep this down to an hour. But we’re needy as babies, and I’ve explained this to you guys in the room already yesterday. When you come out of the womb, you’re completely defenseless. You actually have real needs. Those are real, objective needs that you need or you will die. And our baby selves understand that if we’re not held, if we don’t get that love, we will physically die. It’s important that you, as a baby, get that love. What’ll happen is when you’re a baby, you are lovable. You can shit and people will be like, “Oh shoot, we gotta clean you up.”
When you cry, they’re like, “Oh, what’s he crying about? Is he hungry? Does he need to have a diaper change? Does he just need to be cuddled? What is it?” And they try to figure out what you need. And then you get older, and even when you start to learn your first words, it’s still cute. You say, “Cup”, and they’re like, “Oh my god, he said cup! Yeah!” And people clap when you pee, it’s such a great world. I wish they did that in Singapore, instead of having to do PSLE. “I peed, oh yeah, woo-hoo!” Imagine that world, but that world stopped. That world was awesome, and it ended, and you had no therapy, no coaching and no support to get through that.
Instead, you got the cold, hard reality of no longer being an infant. Now, you saying cup in itself isn’t so cool, you peeing on the ground is not something we just clean up. You go shit on somebody, they don’t thank you for it. They don’t think it’s cute anymore. But it’s important to understand that being needy is natural, but what happened was you didn’t grow out of being needy. You had to find different ways of meeting those needs. So now you panicked, little Johnny, two years old, it’s like, “Aah!” Trying to fake cry to find out whether mommy will come, meet his needs, and pick him up; testing the boundaries of the self, “What is in my control? Shit, these humongous things, these parents, these humongous people with arms and legs, boobs, that sometimes I can suckle. It’s not within my control anymore, it used to be.”
It’d just be a delay of time; how long will it be until I get that boob? “Wah, wah, oh, there it is. It just comes out of nowhere.” And now it’s like, “Oh shit, that thing has a mind of its own, that boob. I can’t just command it and it comes into my mouth. Now, I have to do stuff. What do I have to do?” So this is when we as infants, between 15 to 36 months, found coping strategies. And we probably tried a lot of different ones, but we settled on a particular strategy that worked for us in our parents. Our parents or whoever your primary caregivers were. And for many of my clients and for myself, we settled on the achiever or the pleaser.
Other ones are like the rebel, there’s a joker, there’s the recluse who just hides, withdraws often from physical type of abuse. But the achievers and pleasers are the ones who are like, “Okay, they’re not so impressed by me saying cup anymore. Okay. I’ll read a whole book now and show mommy I can do this. I’ll show mommy I can do my math. I can show mommy if I can do my math, I can do my multiplication tables, then they will love me, and cuddle me, and give me what I want, the love, and affection, approval that I need.
But the Asian families, they fucked you over, man. They never told you you’re a good son. They never told you that. They said that maybe once every five years at best, and they probably didn’t give you much physical affection. That’s starting to change as the world becomes more globalized. Globalization basically just means Westernization, except for food. Everyone loves Asian food. Alright, so coping strategies of achiever and a pleaser, that leads into fixer behavior. When an achiever or pleaser get into a love relationship, or they mistakenly think it’s a love relationship, or what he perceives as a love relationship, he becomes the fixer because that’s the only way, the primary way, that he has learned since he was 2, 3 years old to get love.
His role in the love relationship is the achiever and pleaser. In other words, in the two-way relationship, he is the fixer. He is one who comes and makes everything right. The fixer then, the good guy, will be automatically attracted to someone who inside needs fixing, so he can feel like the white knight. This is deep ass shit. I’m not going to be able to go into it in detail here. I go into it in detail in our most advanced course called Awakenings, and I do that every week: hop on a live show, and work with these guys live, and I go into that in a lot of detail.
But it’s important just to understand that dynamic of taking on the achiever and pleaser coping strategy, which results in a fixer role in your relationships; your white knight role, where you come and try to save her. That also Disney, and Hollywood, and fairy tale romances give us, about the man earning the love of the maiden in the tower. He has to kill everything in the way, slay the dragon, kill the ogre, climb the tower, and then find her, finally, win her sleeping. Fucking bitch was sleeping the whole time. I was destroying half their planet for her and she’s just sleeping.
It’s sort of like when dudes – they have horrible dates, by the way, so we’ve got a whole other course called The Perfect Date System. But one of the reasons why guys need that so bad is because most guys approach dates like they are the knight in shining armor. They approach their dates that way. So the girl, all she has got to do is show up and look pretty. She just has to show up, look presentable. Everything else, fuck, it’s the dude’s thing, man. He’s got to pay for the dinner, he’s got to organize this, he’s got to organize that, he’s got a plan, he’s got to do it all. That’s how fucked up the modern world is.
And yet, the women also want their cake and eat it too. They also want to have the independence and respect. “Don’t open my door/hold the door for me! What do you think, I can’t hold the door for myself?” They want to be able to do that, take the man’s role in society, in life, but then they want to be treated as the defenseless, no money woman. As men, you gotta put your foot down. You want equality, then we’re going to have equality. If you want to be a dependent, then we can do the whole thing where you just show up and look pretty. But if you want equality, then let’s be equal here. Let me show up and look pretty. There’s no reason why not. Just show up and look pretty, and then be spontaneous and have fun.
Go with The Perfect Date System. It’s even better, guaranteed. And when I tell guys what I’m about to tell you now, the first reaction is – not the red pill guys, they’re all going to be like, “Uhuh, uhuh.” But the average dude with relatively little experience with sex and relationships, the average dude is going to be like, “Okay, yeah. I see that. But not my girlfriend”, “Okay, I see that, but not the girl that I want”, “Yeah, I see that, but not the girl in class that I have a crush on. She’s not like that.” They always go for the exceptionalism. It’s that kind of denial that reminds me of – there’s this kid in my school way back. He continued to believe in Santa Claus. This other girl believed in the tooth fairy, she insisted that it existed.
And all of us were like, “There’s no Santa. Come on.” And the teacher would get really mad at us. “Don’t tell her there’s no Santa Claus.” But we’re all looking at her like, “You’re so stupid.” And in a way, we’re like that around relationships, love, and women. I’m trying to tell you the truth. And it’s not like we’re taking them off the pedestal and saying they’re dirty, and nasty, and evil. That’s the red pill mistake. I’m saying they are as dirty, nasty, and evil as you. You have to accept that. That’s all. And yet, there’s a redeemable part of you, I hope. Not all of you, but some of you, just like for women. There’s a redeemable part of you.
What we have been living through is – the same with the red pill guys and the naive guys – it’s like I’m about to tell you that there’s nothing to be afraid of in the dark. I’m going to turn the lights on and show you there’s nothing to be afraid of in the dark, and then I’m going to turn the lights off again and we’re going to get back into reality. But what most guys have done is that they have, instead of growing out of their fear of the dark, they continue to be afraid of the dark but they keep the lights on; they just make enough money that they can keep the lights on 24/7, so that they don’t have to deal with their fear of the dark.
I’m now going to show you, I’m going to pull back the veil and show you the dark side of women, but then also show you there’s nothing to fear about it. This is quite timely. In the Man Up group recently, somebody posted a quote from one of the books I actually will be citing here. And he says, “If that’s true, then how can I not feel insecure as a man?” And I said, “Please elaborate. I’m not sure what you mean.” And he elaborated. Basically, he was just like, “If that’s true, then I’m doomed. If that’s true, there’s no loyalty. If that’s true, there is no love. If that’s true, it’s all over!” Just like a guy who just learned there’s no Santa Claus. It’s okay, someone else will bring you presents.
I’m going to pull back the veil, and reveal that there’s nothing to be afraid of. But first, let’s explore the dark side. Why do you continue to have this belief that women are pure paragons of virtue, who don’t have sexual desires or aren’t as nasty as you? Why do you still resist this? I’ll tell you why: You had a good mother. I had a good mother. And when you think about the difference between a guy who becomes like very few men in the world, who as a teenager discovers that women are a little wild, dark, nasty, and he takes advantage of that because you’re a teenager going through puberty, you will.
Versus us normal guys, it’s all about your momma. It’s all about your momma. Let me give you as an example the life of Iceberg Slim. If you haven’t seen this book, you haven’t read it, I advise you to pick it up. If you’re not American, it can be tough to get through because it’s written in a very colloquial slang. Even I had a hard time going through it, but it was entertaining, definitely.
Basically, I’m going to give you the beginning of the story. This is a real-life pimp. There’s documentaries on him, and all of that. His real name is Robert Beck.
Robert Beck and his mother, when he was growing up, they were poor and penniless, he says. And then there was this upstanding beta male business leader named Henry Upshaw. And just for the guys in the tape, because you guys don’t need to know this, because I’ve been reinforcing it so often, but there’s nothing wrong with being an upstanding beta male. The world needs more upstanding beta males. From a scientific perspective, the only thing that distinguishes an alpha male and a beta male is mating opportunities.
But you know what? A lot of these so-called alpha males, they’re using condoms. They’re not having more babies. What good is it if you are Wolverine but you’re not fucking? You’re not passing on your mutant gene. You’re just tricking your fucking DNA. Meanwhile, upstanding beta male has five kids. He wins. Every one of you guys who have kids has already beaten me, even though I’ve fucked hundreds of women. You win. Your DNA has been passed on, mine yet has not. Maybe later when you watch this video a few years later. Right now, it’s not, so you win, mother fuckers.
And all of these guys are like, “Agh, I’m the pimp. I fucked so many girls.” You already lost from an evolutionary perspective. You care so much about evolution. So many of the guys are like, “Oh, evolution says I gotta do this, so I gotta be this way.” Well, you suck because you’re not doing any of that shit for real. You’re not having 20 kids, 50 kids. You know who won? Osama bin Laden’s dad. That’s really sad to say, but Osama bin Laden’s dad had tons of wives, and he had 50 kids. Osama bin Laden was the 7th child of his mother. Who was looking for significance there, right?
But that motherfucker won. You all with your Harvard degree or whatever fuck shit, you aren’t going to have any babies yet. You lost so far, so fuck this evolution shit. It’s perfectly fine to be an upstanding beta male. You have happiness, fulfillment, and you can actually beat the so-called alpha male now because fucking birth control threw off all of human evolution. So now actually in Singapore too. I’m saying this on tape. I don’t fucking care because Lee Kuan Yew said this.
Who is winning the evolutionary game here? Not the educated people. Not the people Lee Kuan Yew wants to win the evolutionary game. They’re all using birth control and delaying having babies. Who’s fucking winning? You don’t have to say. You all know. And he’s like, “We can’t have that happen! We can’t have that! We need to get our master degree females have popping babies out, so let’s give them some money to pop babies out.” Of course, the people who are popping babies out already, they’re going to take advantage of those baby bonuses too. There’s still an imbalance.
Look at that, fucking birth control threw off all of evolutionary history. You’ve fast forwarded history 100,000 years from now, it’ll be very different from what you predict, because the people who have real advantages, the ones who create great systems like Google, Facebook, they’re not having that many kids. The kings, they’re not having that many children anymore. When you’re the King of China or the Emperor of China, King of Egypt, you had harems and you popped out a shit load of babies. And then all of these other guys who are soldiers, they all died. It’s more like a gorilla type of society; one guy fucks all the women, and the other guys are there to defend that shit.
And that’s not the case anymore. There’s nothing wrong in the modern world with being an upstanding beta male. And if you make enough money as an upstanding beta male, because many upstanding beta male will put their head down and do the work, they’ll make it through middle management, and they’ll make it to VP of Marketing. And what’ll happen is as VP, they’re making decent money, so they can go – if they just need to fuck, they can just go and pay for it. Physically speaking and mentally speaking, it’s the fucking same. They win. Alpha male lost. This is the most equalized opportunities for beta males ever in the history of mankind. Be a beta male, it’s easier.
Henry Upshaw, upstanding beta male, find men that might shake his hand, give them money, “I love this man.” Just based on what he’s said here. Iceberg Slim loves him. He’s like 10 years old. This Henry Upshaw took him under his wing, loved him, and looked up to him. However, his mother cheated on Henry Upshaw with a pimp. She lied to Henry Upshaw. I’m going to skip this section, I used to read this. I did a Mastermind talk a year and a half ago where I did a little more detail on this. So basically what happened was Henry Upshaw whisked them away from their poverty, put them up in a beautiful home, and ferried them around in his car, and at church they were like the talk of the town. Everyone is like, “Oh wow, they’re so awesome.” He was fulfilling her need for significance.
This is when Henry Upshaw really should’ve watched my free course on issue relationship material. This would’ve saved him all of the problems, but he didn’t know that because he was an upstanding beta male. He didn’t understand women. Now, you will, so you will avoid his mistake. Anyway, she cheated on him and then left Henry Upshaw, and he eventually died a year later from heartache. Now, this is a quotation from Iceberg Slim:
“Even I, a ten-year-old, knew that this huge, ugly black man who had rescued momma and me from actual starvation back in Indianapolis loved us with all of his great, sensitive heart. I loved Henry with all of my heart. He was the only father I’d ever really known. He could’ve saved himself an early death from a broken heart. If instead of falling so madly in love with momma, he had run as fast as he could away from her. Yes, poor Henry’s fears had foundation. Momma had never loved Henry. This kind, wonderful man had only been a tool of convenience. One scene in my life I can never forget, and that was that morning when momma had finished packing our clothes, and Henry lost his inner fight for his pride and dignity.”
“He fell down on his knees and bawled like a scolded child, pleading with momma not to live him; begging her to stay. He had welded his arms around her legs, his voice hoarse in anguish as he whimpered his love for us. I will never forget her face as cold as an executioner’s, which she was, as she kicked, and struggled loose from him. And then with an awful grin on her face, she lied to his face and said, “Henry honey, I just want to get away for a while. Darling, we’ll be back.” As the cab drove us away to the secret rendezvous with Steve the Pimp, sitting in his old Model T, I looked back at Henry on the porch, his chest heaving, his tears rolled down his tortured face.”
So then, they moved on, Beck and his mom, and they went back to find Beck’s biological father, who had by that point made good. He made some money, made something of himself, and then she went back to him, and they moved in together. And then the pimp who she was still seeing on the side convinced her to set up Beck’s biological father to rob him of all his possessions. And when Beck’s father came back home, the mother just cried hysterically upon discovering the robbery, and then Beck says this:
“I know my lousy old man deserved what happened to his goods. I know momma got her revenge and it was sweet, I’m sure. But it was bitter for a kid like me to know that momma was part of it. Perhaps if momma had kept that burglary cross a secret from me, in some tiny way, I might’ve been stronger to fight off this pimping disease. I don’t know, but somehow after that cross, momma just didn’t seem like the same, honest, sweet momma that I prayed in church with back in Rockford.” And thus is born, the ladies’ man.
There’s another interview that’s quite interesting. Late in his life, long after he left pimping, Robert Iceberg Beck gave an interview, reminiscing on his life and career. The interviewer said:
“Do pimps hate their whores?” Beck said, “Well, not necessarily consciously. The best pimps that I’ve known, that is the career pimps, the ones who could do 20, maybe 30 years as a pimp, were utterly ruthless and brutal without compassion. They certainly had a basic hatred for women. My theory is, and I can’t prove it: if I were to use the criteria of utter ruthlessness as a guide, that all of them hated their mothers. Perhaps more accurately, I would say that they’ve never known love and affection, maternal love and affection. I’ve known several dozen, in fact, that were dumped into the trash bins when they were, what, only four or five days old?”
The interview said, “You say you loved your mother in your book.” Beck said, “Of course, but underneath the threshold of consciousness, I know that I must’ve hated her, as demonstrated by my neglect of her through the years.” So to people like Iceberg Slim, women were demystified to them at an early age, which made them fall out of love with them. And that did not happen to you. Instead, what happened was you learned some game. And good game, game that actually fucking works. And only scientifically verified game is the game of the Dark Triad.
We will later today explore your dark side. But before that, let’s explore the Dark Triad. The Dark Triad is a handy way of referring to three different psychological problems, we call them, psychological neurosis: narcissism, Machiavellianism, and psychopathy. Briefly, very briefly, because I go into these in much more detail in Awakenings.
Narcissism is characterized by grandiosity, pride, egotism, and a lack of empathy. Machiavellianism is basically game playing right, Machiavelli? Characterized by manipulation, exploitation of others, a cynical disregard for morality, and a focus on self-interest and deception.
Psychopathy is the scariest one of these three. Psychopaths are actually really dangerous. Psychopathy is characterized by enduring anti-social behavior, impulsivity, selfishness, callousness, and remorselessness.
The scientific studies show that those who score highly on the tests for these three also have many more sexual partners than average. There’s a very high correlation between scoring highly on Dark Triad traits, and sexual partners for males and females. And then the scientists come back and say, “Oh, why would this be so?” If you know game, you already know why! It’s always on. “She wants me.” What’s that? Grandiosity, pride, egotism. “No one can hurt me. You can’t throw me off my frame, my belief is my reality.” That’s right there.
Perfect. I’ve just made myself into a narcissist, that’s why I’m so attractive. Machiavellian. You know what push-pull is. You know if she texts you at that time, you should wait this amount of time to text back. You know what the first thing you should say is, you know how to use your emotions to get her to do stuff. Machiavellian, you’re a great game player.
Psychopaths, you got to be cold, ice cold. You can’t feel too much. You can’t let the weakness happen. You gotta put yourself first. You gotta take care of yourself. You gotta watch your investments, make sure she invests more than you. It’s what psychopaths and narcissists do; all of game is like this.
Now, you can learn game superficially: memorize this line, say this. And for a while, maybe a month or so, it won’t be real and in a way that’s when you have shit game. You’re just learning to parrot lines, memorizing shit and spitting it back out. But to actually be good at game, you have to internalize it, and it changes your personality. You have to take on the personality of an attractive man, sexually attractive man. And at the – just purely sexually attractive man… I’m not saying attractive as in to everyone, but sexually attractive; the kind of man who women respond to sexually. It’s right here.
And the better you get at that, the more narcissistic you become, the more of a Machiavellian and psychopath you become. And who does this attract? I didn’t plan to go into this but it attracts female versions of the Dark Triad, because the Dark Triad wants challenge. When you get good at game, you want someone to bander back at you. You want a hot girl who is a challenge, otherwise it is too easy.
It’s like sport fishing, you throw it back in the water. You want a challenge. Guess what? Natural Dark Triads, guys like Slim who became a Dark Triad when he was a teenager, female versions of Slim, the really hot girls who started clubbing when they were 14, 15, 16 years old like in Singapore – where the drinking age is 18 and there’s lax door policies, right?
They will become, very quickly, Dark Triads, because that’s how you get results in the club or in those environments. And they want a challenge. You meet a 21 year old female Dark Triad, she is a fucking veteran. Not in the US because they have like 21 year old drinking age, so I change that to 25 year old woman in the US – she’s a fucking veteran. Modern women, fucking veteran. You guys are going to get eaten up by wolves if you go to the club with no experience like that. And you do; you get eaten up. I was talking to this big group of naive guys who keep getting fucked over, and then they swing over.
America, they got more of the red pill guys, but more around the Westernized nations they have red pill guys who are like, “Well, if this works, and I just keep…” They mistake all of the women they meet as Dark Triads, they’re like, “All women are Dark Triads.” They don’t use these terms, of course, they’re not self-conscious about this at all. But then they’re like, “Fuck. I want to win that game. I gotta win that game against that woman. I gotta win that game against that club slut. I’m going to step it up. I’m going to learn even better how to be a Dark Triad. I’m going to be a Dark Triad level four. She’s a level three. I’m going to move up to level four.” It’s like BJJ, you got a purple belt? I’m going to get a black belt on that shit, and I’ll come back and beat you.
And they just keep stepping it up on their manipulation. Don’t fall into the manosphere trap; that’s where the former momma’s boy turns into the late bloomer’s ladies’ man becomes bitter. This is another one of those things. There’s some statistics that say that 100% of men do not notice that King Kong is in this picture. It’s you. Wait, where is it? Is it there? Can you see it? You probably can’t see it because it’s so bright, but he’s over there. Anyway, don’t fall into the manosphere trap. All you guys watching this basically used to be momma’s boys, the opposite of Slim.
You had a good mom. You didn’t walk into her fucking five guys getting rimmed in the face and shit, right? Good. Just thinking about that is really gross, right? That means you’re a momma’s boy. You actually necessarily unconsciously put pussy on a pedestal. And one way to get that off the pedestal is to go swing completely the other way and become a Dark Triad. But it’s still fake, you’re not doing it for real. You have to actually confront the dark side of women for real. And it’s a lot like finding out – when you find out for real the things I’m going to tell you now after this slide.
It’s like finding out there’s no Santa Claus when you’re 30 instead of 5. If that teacher kept saying, “Don’t tell him there’s no Santa Claus” and he’s like, “Where’s Santa? Where’s Santa? Fuck, there’s no Santa anymore.” And he’s like, “There’s no Santa?” What happens is he develops a bitter chip on his shoulder because he feels cheated and lied to for so long. “So long, none of you people told me there was no Santa?” And that’s what happens like you guys, figuring out game when you hit 30.
And the difference is, the natural ladies’ man, the Becks, the Slims of the world who figured it out when they were teenagers, they learned to accept over time the woman’s dark nature, their Dark Triad natures. And then they might’ve even given them a begrudging acceptance, and they don’t well on them. He has learned to adjust to their flaws early and he’s even learned to appreciate them. However, the late bloomer former beta male feels lied to for so long and dwells on all the grief, embarrassment, and heartache he could’ve avoid for so long. I’m speaking to you, manosphere guys right now, you red pill, MGTOW guys. You are late-bloomer former beta males figuring it out now that you’re old, older.
They then obsess over the Dark Triad nature of women, “Sluts! Whores!” He feels betrayed, and then unconsciously develops revenge on the whores. “Get them all!” And then they compulsively post shit on their Facebook, anti-women shit. They can’t even help themselves. They’re obsessed about it. It feeds into his self-righteous sense of betrayal even more, which then motivates him to search out even more evidence. He goes from dividing all women into Madonnas and whores. Mom’s a Madonna, my sister’s a Madonna, and all of these club sluts, they’re all whores.
And then as he gets more experienced, he becomes more bitter. He lumps them all into the whore category, or he’ll say, “At least 90% of them are whores.” His life becomes a giant exercise of confirmation bias. Don’t make that mistake. Keep your eyes open because they are just as evil as you. If you believe you are redeemable, that slutty girl is redeemable too. And maybe, just maybe, you can find a girl who has opened her eyes to reality. Because what you don’t want is a naive one, like a village girl. And you bring the village girl to Singapore or to New York. And she’s hot, right, a hot village girl, bring her to New York, she’s ruined. Ruined.
It’s like bringing a village boy to the go-go bar. He’s ruined. You bring him to Jakarta, it’s over. He has lost. For at least four years, put some money in his hand, he is done. He is gone. You’ll not see him. At night, he’s going to have like this, “Oh, where were you man?”, “Oh, I don’t know. I was at the strip club until 5:00AM. It was amazing.” What you want is a girl who has seen it but hasn’t been ruined yet, just like a girl wants a man who has not fucked the entire village hopefully, but has seen it and isn’t tempted by it. That’s the best situation. Moving into that, keep your eyes open because they exist. Those women who are sexual creatures. If you know how to treat them, they’ll respond to you with loyalty.
If you meet all of their needs and she meets your needs, why would you go anywhere else? They will only stray when you’re not meeting those needs. Now, it’s important to understand this, and I’m getting into this in the Rock Solid Relationships, how to meet the needs, but always with the caveat of: choose wisely whose needs you meet. Keeping that as a caveat, let’s dive in. Some of you guys here in this room know this. I’ve presented this in various places around the world, in universities and different stages, and I’m still shocked at how few men and few people know this research. But most of you here in this room, this should be review for you.
Meredith Chivers, and the plethysmograph, and the fMRI, the most famous study. They took women and men, showed them eight different conditions under an fMRI. The plethysmograph, by the way, is this thing. It’s also the technology used in the Apple Watch to measure your heart rate, these pulsing green lights, they are plethysmograph lights, and they basically measure blood flow. What they do is they insert this baby into her vagina, and measure blood flow. If there’s blood flowing down there more than usual, she’s aroused. The brain scan also tells you arousal. They can see arousal in it as well.
And then they also give her a pad, a keypad where she indicates whether she is aroused, yes or no. The eight conditions are: monkeys mating, bonobos to be specific, bonobos fucking; heterosexual sex; female-female sex; male-male sex; a man masturbating; a woman masturbating; a man who is chiseled walking on the beach; a well-toned woman doing calisthenics on the beach. For the men, they didn’t use this. They don’t put it in your ass or something. They used a penis pump. And so, it displaced air if you were aroused. You can just look down. I mean, it’s pretty obvious, right?
It’s hard for a man to lie, but you know, they’ve put this in women. Now, the men were aroused under two conditions and two conditions only. Straight males were aroused by heterosexual sex and female-female sex. That was it. But women were aroused by all eight conditions. They were even aroused by mating of monkeys and male-male sex. Just sex in any way, just like, “Oh, it’s sex.” But what’s interesting is the keypad, they’re saying yes, no, yes, no. They’re saying no on everything except female-female and male-female. They don’t fucking know.
And this leads to this wonderful video, and I just realized I still have the music on. I’ll play this video because it’s so short and fun. And it says, “Every time I ask my girl what she wants to eat.” This is from The Notebook.
Man: What do you want? What do you want?
Woman: It’s not that simple.
Man: -do you want? Goddamn it, what do you want?
David Tian: Girls don’t even know what they want. That was my only point. That was just fun. They don’t know what they want, they don’t know what turns them on. They don’t know. So if you just straight up ask them, “What do you want in this relationship?” You gotta listen to what she says if she’s older, especially, if she’s very self-aware, she will actually straight up tell you. But most women are not even in tune with their bodies. In fact, there are theories to try to explain the confounding why that would be disconnect, and it’s a very simple one: It’s easier to lie when you believe the lie.
If the man says, “Are you turned on by that other male?” She’s like, “No.” He’s going to be like, “Hmm, let me check.” She’s just lying and she’s like, “I’m not”, but she is. I mean, that’s a great way to lie, to actually mean it. So, here’s another example. Female masturbation and porn use. It turned out a study from Ohio Study University was identical to the male’s.
Female masturbation and porn use was identical in males. In fact, under certain conditions – there were three conditions that they did the tests under. One was where you knew, you made eye contact with the person doing the study, and you knew this person was a classmate.
The second conditions was confidentiality. This should be completely conditional. We signed the confidentiality agreement on both sides. And then the third was you thought you were getting hooked up to a polygraph test.
And then on all three conditions, you are asked the question, “How many sexual partners have you had? How often do you use porn? How often do you masturbate?” The males were pretty consistent all the way through. They didn’t have anything to hide. Women, when they thought that they were under confidentiality, the number of reported sexual partners increased to about the same as the males reported.
And then when they thought they were under a polygraph test, it shot way above what males were. It takes two people to fuck. So either one guy is really doing a lot of work, and that’s probably the case. It’s always three percent, the Pareto principle, or they’re fucking dudes who are not in college.
But under the polygraph conditions, it turns out, holy shit, these college girls, they masturbate, they use porn, they fuck a lot of different dudes as much as your guy friends. Here’s another great example: James Deen. James Deen is now charged for various kinds of things like rape and shit like that.
But when I first made these slides, he wasn’t. James Deen, even now I would say, is probably the most well-known pornstar to females. You’ve probably never heard of him. I don’t know, maybe you have, but the male porn stars usually are what guys like to see; some big dude dominating the girl, big muscled steroided dude.
Maybe he doesn’t use steroids because he’s a porn star. You gotta make sure that shit’s working. But anyway, he’s this big dude, right? And as I was saying earlier, my pants are really tight. If I knew this wasn’t going out, it’s just going out to this video to dudes, I would not be wearing slim jeans, skinny jeans, I would be wearing dude jeans. What guys think look good – girls think, “Oh, that looks good.” If a guy thinks, “Oh, that looks good”, he’s like a girl, he’s gay, right? Good fashion that turns women on will often turn men off.
And the same with the sex stars here. The male pornstar that girls like – guys just generally – you would think, “Oh, this guy is a pornstar. What’s so special about him?” And that’s part of what’s special about him. He’s like the guy next door kind of look. And I’ve heard from the research, there’s GQ feature articles on him. There’s all of these interviews with him, he has his own website and stuff, that girls really like his facial expressions and his sincerity. In other words, his believability. Another study by Wallen and Rupp showed that women were as aroused during porn viewing as men were. And now, we have all the devices to measure arousal.
So women like that shit. They just like to look at different shit, but it’s still porn. It’s not like the softcore. They like that nasty shit, man. They like to see it. They like to see vagina. Here’s some more evidence for that. On the perspective that women are more turned on by emotions, and men are more turned on by viewing stuff, men are more visual, women are more feeling, here’s some evidence to show that that’s total bullshit.
Probably the only study that really gave evidence for that old view was where they showed men, “Here’s a photo of this beautiful celebrity. Would you fuck her, yes or no?” Men, they all said, “Yeah, I’d fuck her.” And then they showed the women, “Here’s a male celebrity. Would you fuck him?” They’re like, “Oh, not really.” And they’re like, “Aha, see! Women are turned on by emotions. They have to have a connection to get on, to get aroused. Men just need to see her.”
And then they re-ran that study, same conditions but different subjects, obviously different female stars. So, this time, they used Angelina Jolie and they used an old Christie Brinkley. And they asked the men, “If no one else found out, would you fuck them?” “Hell yeah.” And now they changed that. I should’ve written down who the old male stars were, but they were not attractive male stars. And this time, they swapped out the stars. They gave Johnny Depp and Brad Pitt. Good old Brad. And they said to the girls, “If no one else found out, would you fuck Johnny Depp? Would you fuck Brad Pitt?” And they’re all like, “Hell yeah, 10 out of 10.”
Here’s another example. Another example from Chivers, another experiment from Chivers. Women were shown photos of various conditions, and then they used the same things, the plethysmograph, the fMRI, and they found out that women were aroused by all four of these photos: the erect penis, the slack penis, the demure vulva, and then the spread vulva.
Under all four conditions, they were aroused, but they were most aroused by the erect penis. And now, you all can be sending penis pics. They’re all aroused by that, just as a thing – the reason why you shouldn’t just be sending penis pics as an opener, because yes, she might be aroused, but arousal is different from what you’re going to do with it.
Just like when you see Krispy Kreme donuts, you might be aroused by it. It doesn’t mean you’re going to give up everything and go and eat it, just to be clear about that. But to say that she’s not aroused by it, that’s just denial. Just like if a nasty girl, a girl you don’t like at all, she’s done some evil thing that she kills your mom, and then she sends you a pic of her pussy. You’d be like, “Fucking bitch.” Yeah, still, a pussy’s a pussy.
Alright, here’s another example. This is the one that’s really going to kill you, or to kill the naive guys. Another experiment that came out of the Stage Lab run by Chivers and Queens University. They used a plethysmograph, they used a keypad, but then this time they used audio fantasies. Instead of photos, instead of videos, they used audio. And the only thing that they changed in the three conditions were a few words, where it was either a stranger or a friend, or a long-time lover. And then they changed the genders of each of those.
And then they gave these audio fantasies to the females and the males. Here’s what they found for the females. The females, the women, found the female strangers twice as arousing as female friends. They ran this fantasy, “Oh, but if it was a stranger, oh, they want to get down with the female stranger.” So, if you want to get a threesome with your girl and her best friend, it’s a lot harder than a cold approach threesome with some girl she’s never met. That’s how we use research to get what we want. That’s how you do it.
Here’s another finding. Women found male strangers eight times more arousing than male friends. Eight times! Kaboom, man. This is the best evidence for the friend zone. Eight times. You might as well be a stranger to her if you want to get sex. This is the friend zone couch. So if you’re in the friend zone, you’re really in damage control. You gotta get our free video course, How to Get Out of the Friend Zone. And here’s the one that may be the most surprising to you.
We find out that women are more turned on by female strangers than female friends, they are far more turned on – eight times more – by doing a male stranger than a male friend. So much for friendship, they don’t count for much for sexual attraction.
Strangers, complete male strangers, were slightly more arousing than long-time lovers. That means you can spend 30 years with this wife, and she’ll still be slightly more aroused, on average, by a male stranger who is hot. [INAUDIBLE 01:10:33] it can increase. Strangers are slightly more arousing than long-time lovers. Sex with strangers.
So, where is this connection in the old-school way of thinking between women need emotional connection, and they need it to have sex? No, they fucking don’t. They’re like you motherfuckers. You guys driving the red light district traffic- I’m not talking about you specifically, just for the effect of the video. Women are just as nasty. Here’s some more evidence of nasty.
The power of language in words in female arousal. 50 Shades of Grey, the best-selling book. Oh, I haven’t put it out there yet. The best-selling book of its time. In fact, there was a time when all three of the trilogy books were at the top of the list.
And this book is only purchased by one-half of the population, of the world, and yet it beat all the other books. It even beat the Bible. What can we say about that one? The Harlequin romance industry before 50 Shades of Grey was already a 1.5 billion dollar industry in itself.
Those stupid books – we don’t see them here in Singapore – but if you go to America, they have those throwaway books by the cash register, and they’ve got Fabio with his long hair and his arms around her. Her blouse is getting torn away, and they’re on some ship at sea, and he’s like… You know, Harlequin romances.
So many women buy those things. This is a real great example of the same genre, and it beat out all the other books in the world. A study at University of North Texas found that 30% to 60% of women admit to rape fantasies.
The authors argue the actual numbers would be higher if they used polygraph or confidentiality conditions. There are various reasons for this. Meston at UT Austin gives the excitation transfer theory. Chivers uses lubrication under sexual attack theory. I think that’s the best one. One thing to say here is that arousal is not consent.
I’ve mentioned that earlier, but I want to reiterate that here. It’s possible to be aroused by all sorts of things you didn’t in fact want in real life; arousal is not consent. But they sure do like that stuff. So one of the things women tell you all the time, “I want to make love. I don’t want to fuck. I don’t want fucking.” That’s a fucking lie. They think, if she’s the average woman, they think that’s what you want to hear. They think, “If he thinks I’m not a slut, then he’ll love me more. He’ll stay with me.” And in the meantime, in their minds, they got nasty fantasies going on. Just like you guys when you’re fucking your girlfriend for the fifth year and you’re thinking about that porn you looked at the other day.
Women are the same. Just drop all that fake bullshit and just go for real. Learn how to have the dominant sex and do that 80% of the time, 60-70% of the time. And then of course, you still have that making love, deepen the eyes, tantra kind of sex. But sometimes, those girls just want some old-fashioned fucking; and they want it actually more often than not. I mean, if there’s no better evidence of this in 50 Shades of Grey – I mean, to be able to dominate not just physically but mentally submit, it’s very powerful.
Here’s another example of this. This is an actual disorder. It used to be called hypoactive sexual desire disorder. It’s been recognized as a distinct sexual function disorder for already over 30 years. Addyr is approved by the FDA as treatment for female sexual arousal disorder. And this is basically where she ain’t turned on no more. So if she’s not turned on no more, you can take her to the doctor.
This is a real disorder. We can treat this. Pussy ain’t wet, you don’t want to have sex? Don’t worry. We’ll go and meet the doctor. And the doctor, the dangerous part about this is the side-effect, is unconsciousness.
“I want to get turned on!” And like, okay, very bad. It’s not very popular yet. I think more guys have tried to get it than women. But the trials for all the different variations of this – before this one came out, there was another drug that was really popular being tested. The FDA has not approved that yet, but there’s two drugs together that they used. And there were lists of hundreds of thousands of women waiting to be tested on this. They wanted to get it back. Why? Because they have storge and philia with their husband, maybe even agape with their husband, but they don’t have eros.
So, they’re in this relationship, and they have kids, and the woman wants the relationship to work, but she just doesn’t want to have sex with him, and she feels guilty about it. Every Friday night, sex night, he walks up the stairs, creaking, she’s like, “Oh fuck, it’s sex night. How fast can I get this over?” And she just slides there like a fish, “Are we done yet? Can you just cum, hurry up? Okay. You’re done? Okay, great. Let’s go watch some movies. Let’s go watch Netflix and chill.” And these women feel really bad about this. They see the dissatisfaction in her husband who she loves like a brother, so they go and they want to get turned on again. They want to rediscover. They think there’s something wrong with themselves, which in a way there is.
I’m going to skip how this drug works, but the foremost expert in FSAD is Marta Meana, UNLV. She does group and individual therapy. She’s been doing this for decades.
And she has found that the greatest predictor of FSAD, the greatest correlation, is relationship duration. Has that bubble burst yet? Has the pussy come of the pedestal yet? The longer you’re in that relationship, the greater the chances she won’t be turned on by you no more. She’ll have to use the drug that makes her unconscious.
And she has found that actually, in group and individual therapy, the best, most reliable cure for FSAD is the introduction of novelty – or in other words, other dudes. You take her to a swingers group, and woo-hoo, she’s having the time of her life. She wants to fuck. She wants to do it all kinds of ways. And he’s like, oh shit. This is interesting. You don’t even need the drug.
You just take her and let her fuck some other dudes. How do we know that this is true? How can you know? Because you’re that way. Come on, man. I don’t care how long you’ve been in a relationship. I’ll take you to the right places and I’ll say, “I’ll buy this one for you.”
When I turn around, you ain’t there no more. You’d be, “Oh, where’d he go?” You want some. And I know one of the greatest fears of men who have some game is that, “I gotta fuck the same pussy my whole life? What?” You know, you can fuck the same pussy like 90% of the time.
Come on, maybe on my birthday, let me fuck some strange. Maybe a few times a year, let me go to Jakarta or some shit. Come on, man. Just let me have some Vegas time for myself.” You’re like that and you can get it going again, because sometimes the sex get perfunctory, because you’ve been doing the same way, it’s the same woman for 50 years. Actually, in your case, not 50, but whatever, 5 years.
It’s old. And just the fact that it’s new, that girl you’re fucking may not be as hot as your wife. In fact, what I’ve done is this – because I have a lot of friends who are married. And when they go out and do some strange, they end up picking girls who look like their wives.
It’s like, dude, what are you doing, man? You have this at home. But it’s just ‘new’. He loves his wife, it’s just his dick is responding to the new. And there’s something about – even in sales, in marketing, when you say it’s ‘new’, we want it. Like the iPhone. What’s different about it? Who cares, it’s new. It’s the new one!
Women are the same way. And the dangerous thing is, what’ll happen is, women will feel this quicker. Why? Because it’s harder for a 45, 50, 60 year old man to get back in the dating scene and make it happen. He’s going to have to pay. If he’s not a social guy, if he hasn’t been working on his masculinity and his polarity, for him to enter a social scene at 50-years old and try to pick up some chicks, take home and fuck, it’s going to be hard.
But the sad thing is, even an old lady, if she has a makeover, gets some Botox and shit, she dresses the right way, and she’s doing yoga and stuff – you throw her into a dark bar, and she’s like, “Hey, who wants to have sex?” Dudes will line up. Free sex? They’ll do it. They’re like, “How far do we have to go? Are bathrooms okay?” They’ll do it. That’s the sad truth. Right now, the mating world is still skewed very much toward the woman. That’s why one up versus one down. As the relationship goes on, the woman will be in the one up position because she feels guilty and feels pity for the man. She ain’t feeling it sexually for him and she loves him like a brother. And they’re partners in raising their kids.
But man, there’s no passion, there’s no eros, there’s no fucking desire. And meanwhile the dude is in the bottom and he’s like, “How do I make her turned on?” And I know it, because so many of these guys write to me. “How do I turn on my woman? How do I do it?” And they’re in the one down. The one down is a lot more helpless. The one up, if she is magnanimous, generous, and has integrity and compassion, and she will help the one down and be able to ride that see-saw. They will go to the doctor together and she will say, “I really feel bad. I want to have our sex life get rekindled with passion again. What can we do?”
And she’ll be a partner with that. But most women will not. Especially any woman that a red pill guy enters a relationship with. Why? Because in that relationship, I didn’t get to go into this but I did for you guys yesterday at the three levels of love, red pill guys, manosphere guys, they get into relationships with women looking out for number one. And they expect her to look out for herself. When they do that, as soon as this goes off balance, it’s game over. The person at the top is not going to help the person at the bottom. Relationship is over.
There are two paths. I’ve been telling you about the dark side, the reality, the science of long-term relationships; the science of female arousal. There are two paths. The one that everybody wants, where the man/woman at some point in your life, you wanted this.
It was a fantasy that you believed in. When you’re young, you want to do everything together. When you’re older, you want to go everywhere together. And when you’ve been everywhere and done everything, all that really matters is that you’re together. And it’s an old couple walking in the park together, holding hands. You want this.
And the red pill, manosphere, MGTOW said, “This is a myth! This isn’t true!” And I don’t know about this, but to go from here to here, you might’ve seen it if you think about it. Maybe your grandparents are still in love, maybe your parents. It’s possible but it’s getting increasingly difficult. And the more you hold on to the troubadour myth, the more you will not experience this and not see people who do this. And the divorce rate will just continue to rise.
Because back in the day, people who weren’t experiencing this, they pretended like they were and they just led a life of quiet desperation. But now, it’s easy to get a divorce. Everyone does. So it’s more of like, “Which divorce are you on?” They’ll just break it off. As soon as it gets really hard, when the see-saw gets unhinged or out of whack, they just give up. “Ah, it’s too hard. Let’s just start over with a new couple, new partners.”
Now in my old presentation that I was doing last year, I ended with this. “No love without freedom.” And this is what the more enlightened ex-PUAs are doing, which is like open relationships. A great example of this that I used to teach a whole other course on is actually inspired by Reid Hoffman’s book, LinkedIn founder, on hiring. I forget the name of the book now, but it was about the fact that now, our economy is different. It wasn’t like in the 80s, or what Japan used to think it was.
You started with a company after school, and you stayed with that company until you retire. Now, people are jumping from job to job, company to company. And to have the illusion that that person you’re hiring was going to be with you forever until they retire is really naive.
Let’s prepare for the fact that you’re going to leave in three to five years, and let’s make that explicit. What can we do under those conditions and how can we make you happy knowing that? And then we can renew at every point. On both sides, you can stay with us or we can continue to have you.
In that sense, there’s freedom. We know how hard it will get in the future. I think that’s a very enlightened perspective. Another great one is if you Google Gwyneth Paltrow’s relatively recent divorce, and it was a very enlightened separation. They put out a statement about it, about the therapist’s view of marriage and divorce. This could work. It’s a pretty new arrangement.
But what you give up on is this dream. I’ve been studying the couples that have actually lived this. We have life expectancy issues, we didn’t have to deal with this before. Now we do. We can live until 95, 100, some of us in this room can live over 100. How do you have a relationship that starts at 30 and goes for 70 years? You keep it strong.
I’ve been studying that for many years, and there’s a radical solution. They are based on two principles. This is polarity, I’m showing plus-minus here. Over time, you become who you spend time with.
And you’re going to spend the most time ever with your life partner. You will both depolarize. You’ll become more feminine, she’ll become more masculine. That’s assuming you were masculine to begin with, but you’ll basically become like each other. That’s part of the reason why the eros disappears.
It is not a biological impossibility. Novelty is something you need to navigate. But just the fact that you still have the machinery, and so does she. There’s no biological impossibility about that. But it is difficult to maintain the polarity over time. And the other thing you need to bring is your presence. Over time, you take each other for granted.
Over time, you have discussions where you’re looking off into the distance, the both of you, together, doing something together as partners. That’s what buddies do. Male to male friends, they sit there and fish together. There’s always an activity. They make it about the activity and they do it together.
They go shooting together or something. Face to face with your dude friend to do something is awkward, unless you’re fighting. But you do something, you watch a movie together, you have drinks together, you do something together. Women aren’t like that. Women sit across from each other and they talk, they get in at the present. The woman wants presence, the man’s natural thing is to, “Okay, I got her now. I don’t have to be present no more. Let’s be partnerships.”
A partnership is going to kill the arousal. Bring your presence. I covered this in Rock Solid Relationships. We’re in pilot program for that at the moment. When that launches, you may hear about it.
But the only way you will hear about it is if you join the private Man Up Facebook group.
Join that group right now! We approve requests daily and you get a lot of free courses. I’ve mentioned a bunch of them in there, issue relationship material, to screen and select the right person to invest in. We also cover how to get out of the friend zone if you find yourself on the friend zone couch, and we also go into how to make a relationship passionate.
It’s a crash course in it, but it also serves as a preview into a much more detailed examination and training in passion and polarity and presence. I leave you with this, my friends. It is possible. It is a radical solution.
It is something that actually requires some training and understanding, but it’s actually quite simple. It’s very simple but not easy. It’s simple but it requires practice and it requires application, but it is very simple. So I leave you with that.
Thank you very much for watching this video. Thank you all of you guys in this room.
We’re now going to continue with the rest of our program here, and we’ll end the video here for now.
Join the private Facebook group and I’ll see you inside there. David Tian, signing out.