Man Up | Ep. 106 • May 06, 2016
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or over a decade, David Tian, Ph.D., has coached tens of thousands of people from over 87 countries to achieve happiness and success in their dating and love lives.
Once a nerdy, skinny professor of philosophical psychology who couldn’t hold a conversation to save his life, David is now director of Aura Transformation Corp., and a world renowned dating and life coach using therapeutic methods. Dr. Tian has been featured in international media, including AXN, Cosmopolitan, Psychology Today, as well as co-hosting a radio show on national radio and a weekly dating advice column in a national newspaper in Singapore. Formerly a professor at the National University of Singapore, Dr. Tian is actively researching, speaking, and publishing in the areas of philosophy and psychology.
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David Tian: Boom! Stop. In Episode 106, I answer the question of: How to handle her temper tantrums?
Masculinity for the intelligent man. I’m David Tian, Ph.D. and this is Man Up!
Hi! I’m David Tian, Ph.D. And welcome to the Man Up show. This is Episode 106… Right? 106, yes. And I forgot the intro. For the past ten years, I’ve been helping tens of thousands of people in over 87 countries achieve success in dating and relationships, And here I am in Shanghai. You can see here the pearl tower, just in case you didn’t see the last episode. I gave a nice quickie view. Oh man, you can see the room. It’s kind of annoying, but anyway, there you go. There’s the Pudong tower. There it is. If you can see across the river is the start of The Bund, so that’s kind of cool.
Alright, so I’m shooting in the room. Cool. Now, I’m finishing Frank’s question. So, Frank originally asked a question that was couched in terms of Asian versus non-Asian women, which is more fierce. So, I answered that in the previous episode. And now, I’m going to get to his example. So, he gives an example. He says, “I had been extraordinarily lucky to date some amazing Asian women, and one who holds a special place in my heart. When she gets mad, hell hath no fury like her. She gets really worked up and unleashes it on me. I just have to take it like a man, let it blow over, and then things are all better. As an example, we’ll stay up…”
So, that in itself, what he just said there, is fine. That in itself is fine. “We’ll stay up late on a weekend night watching movies, making love, et cetera, well beyond her bedtime. The next morning, something will wake us up early: Her dogs, street traffic, et cetera, and she gets pretty irritated at me for having kept her up so late and she didn’t get enough sleep. I just have to apologize and take it like a man, even though we both wanted to watch a movie and make love. Even though we both wanted that.
“She is crazy mad for an hour or two, during which I have to leave her the hell alone, let her wind down and then she will calm down and be reasonable. In the past, because I’m a pretty tough son of a bitch myself, I get into heated arguments with her on stuff like this, and it would escalate and we would both really start getting heated and hating each other for a while. It led to a couple of separations, which was completely silly and stupid over such little issues.
After a while, I realized the best thing to do was just let her cool down, give her space, and let logic regain control. Because being reasonable was out of the question. The male mind wonders, “What the fuck is she going on and on about such a little thing, and it wasn’t even my fault?” And trying to reason with her, but none of it works. The best thing for me to do is just leave her alone after I apologize, even if it’s not my fault, and come back later when she’s cooled down.
This is just an example, but I feel like the Asian girls I’ve dated in the US are more fierce than non-Asian girls.” I think you just have a really immature girl, that’s all. I’m going to try to keep these episodes under eight minutes now. Wow, the tower behind me looks like it’s going to blow up or something. That’s kind of cool. So, what you have articulated, Frank, is perfectly fine. In the generalities, in the abstract, they sound good. People have moods, women generally have a lot more chemicals coursing through their bodies on a monthly basis, if you get what I mean. Like, either coming off that period or moving towards that period or in it, they also have a lot more chemical changes in their bodies. And you know, if she’s a feminine woman, and there’s…
So to address the Asian/non-Asian, there’s Asian women who are more feminine than they are masculine, and there are some non-Asian women who are that way as well. So, I’m going to put aside the race here, because there are some areas in which race does play an issue. Areas like shame, and face, and things like that, but this is not one of those cases.
So, in the abstract, what you’ve said is fine. But this example here… So, she’s in her feminine energy. Women in their feminine energy will be more moody, more tempestuous, but that doesn’t excuse them for being wrong. Okay? So these are like drama queens. And in the comments, you wrote ‘shit-tests’, right? This is something that’s really important to point out in terms of a wrong way of thinking about things. PUAs went around talking about shit-tests and passing shit-tests, and that was just a bad thing to do. Because as soon as you think of it as a test, then it seems like it’s your job as the man to pass the test that some girl gives to you. What position does that put the girl in? It puts her in the position of the teacher, of the master, of the person who actually has the authority to give you a test, like the government.
That’s really bad. Over the long run, it just fucks you up. It’s a bad relationship dynamic. So, she mentioned – she tells you she loves your masculinity. That hits you over the head with these shit-tests when she gets upset. You know, there’s some new age bullshit. One of the problems with David Deida’s book “Way of the Superior Man”, which is otherwise a great book, but one of the problems in that approach in general… And David Deida’s a great example of that approach, of the new age tantra approach, broadly speaking, is the idea that it’s the job of the man to withstand the storms of the woman. Like the Shiva standing against the storms of the goddess or something.
And this can excuse a lot of bad behavior. So, think about… There’s this famous quote that Marilyn Monroe has been attributed to her, and if a girl starts throwing this in your face, just run the other way. Just politely back out and then just go. And the quote is this, “If you can’t handle me at my worst, you don’t deserve my best. If you can’t handle me at my worst, you don’t deserve my best.” Some bullshit like that. And then if she quotes Marilyn Monroe at all, you should just run. Like, just give her an Alcoholics Anonymous handbook and just say, “Good luck with that shit.”
But a lot of guys will be into that, because a girl who’s like that should probably be wild, should probably be kind of slutty. And it entices guys who are naive, and most men are naive in the modern world. So, that girl is going to have a great run until she hits her 30s, then suddenly she’s going to fucking freak out because she can’t have a baby. Or she’s like, “Woah, no guy will want me.” Yeah, because of all the shit you did in your 20s.
So, if this is along those lines – in other words, you do not give her a fucking… She doesn’t get a get out of jail free card just because she’s a fucking freak. Sometimes, she can be emotional. So, if she wakes up late on a weekend and blames you, that’s kind of cute for two seconds. If she sticks at it for like an hour – you said she gets crazy mad for an hour or two and you just wait until she becomes more reasonable. If she then apologizes for the crazy mad shit she did, for those two hours, then you can just talk it up to the fact that you have a slightly more emotional girl than – I shouldn’t say slightly, a more emotional girl than a mature person should be.
If however she has you in the position of – you’re fucking apologizing for shit that’s not your fault, because you ended that paragraph with this, “The best thing for me to do is to just leave her alone after I apologize, even if it’s not my fault and come back after she’s cooled down.” Come back after she’s cooled down, yes, but don’t fucking apologize for shit that’s not your fault. You do not want to get in the habit, or in the position. You don’t want to condition yourself to be apologizing for shit that’s not your fault.
Just back out. Just get out of there. If she’s got to go and be alone and deal with her own shit. Because you know what? I get it. You know why people are mad when they wake up late? Because they’re afraid. There’s a lot of fear. And instead of confronting her fear that she’s not going to get shit done. Maybe she’s dealing with some conditioning from her childhood when being lazy was bad. So now, she’sinternalizing all that shit, and she wakes up, she’s like freaking out. And instead of blaming herself and taking responsibility in herself for staying up too late, she projects it onto you and blames you. This is a very bad sign, by the way. That’s why I say she’s immature. She’s not going to be able to handle the stress. She’s going to blame other things.
Imagine at her workplace, when she gets to a very high level, like a managerial level, and shit goes down. She’s not going to take it on herself. She’s going to blame all these other people at work, and then afterwards fucking regret it. But by then, that’s a professional situation. You can’t unfire somebody like that. Right now, she’s just abusing you emotionally because you’re going to take it. You’re going to suck it up and take it because that’s what you think you ought to do. But if you want to stay with this girl and you want to stay with her until she matures, you’re going to put up with these storms, but do not be in the position of apologizing for stuff that’s not your fault.
And do not encourage any of these temper tantrums, like a little fucking baby. If she’s a baby, and it’s okay she’s a baby, then that’s fine. That’s a decision you made. But you don’t want to encourage this. You do not want to encourage Marilyn Monroe bullshit behaviors in the girl. Because what it is basically letting her get away with is being a total fucking bitch and then saying, “Oh, but you got to deal with that because you want me at my best.” Guess what? Why don’t you, as a man, say all the shit girls say at you? Why don’t you just throw a temper tantrum for no fucking good reason and then say, “Bitch, apologize. I know it’s not your fault, but fucking apologize.”
Do you realize how fucked up that is? This is just a sign of an emotionally immature person. I mean, imagine a universe in which criminals could get away with crimes by saying, “Hey look, take me at my worst. If this country isn’t going to take it at my worst, it doesn’t deserve me at my best.” What the fuck? No, throw her in fucking jail, that’s what they ought to do. Anyway, don’t put up this shit. This is not called a shit-test. It’s called stupidity tests. And it’s a shit-test for you, actually, from the universe. Because the universe is testing you whether you know what your values are and what you’re goingto stand for in your life.
Becauseif you’re getting tested this way by girls, you’re also getting tested this way by other people, by dudes who are trying to take advantage, maybe asking for extra favors. For, “Hey man, can you pick up those cigarettes on the way over?”, “Hey man, can you get this round?”, “Hey man, can you get dinner for me? I forgot some money”, “Hey man, can you get the bottle this time?” Shit like that, and you’ll be like, “Oh.” Because you’re not used to saying, “No.”
How do I know these things? I used to be there. I used to be the passive-aggressive or the person who didn’t assert himself, mostly because I didn’t know what was the right thing to do and what I wanted in my life. I was just happy to have friends around or some shit. And a lot of people have never been taught because school doesn’t teach you, your parents don’t teach you, society doesn’t teach you; haven’t been taught how to use or how to develop their own sense of values and then how to assert their values and their boundaries.
So, yes. I would say proceed very cautiously with this girl. Any girls in the future that are this way, you should proceed cautiously with if you have a long-term relationship in mind. But also more importantly, and I’m going to leave you with this, ask yourself why you’re drawn to women like this. Because I feel like you have a history of relationships with women like this, which would lead you to the generalization that Asian women are more fierce and aggressive; because you’re the fucker who’s drawn to them. You’re the guy who’s choosing those girls. There are plenty of demure, sweet girls that you’re not choosing. They don’t show up on your radar.
But the ones who are kind of freaks, they’re the ones that you’re into. So, that’s something that you should ask yourself about. I mean, it’s just a matter of taste as well, but it also might be an issue – actually, it’s not might, it’s an issue with where you’re at, psychologically. But you know, that’s not the question you originally asked, but I’m going to point that out for you as a bonus gift. This is something that may take you many years to discover about yourself. But you can get thinking about that already.
I have a bunch of friends who are definitely drawn to drama queens, and it’s something in themselves and it’s very interesting as a thing to explore psychologically. Okay, and I will leave you with Shanghai in the background, pearl tower there. And join the private Facebook group where you can ask questions, you can read full questions like Frank’s full questions there. And I will see you inside there. Hope I didn’t just make that too loud. And I kind of kept these under. I’m going to try to get them down below ten minutes in the future. Until then, Man Up!