Man Up | Ep. 169 • January 20, 2017
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or over a decade, David Tian, Ph.D., has coached tens of thousands of people from over 87 countries to achieve happiness and success in their dating and love lives.
Once a nerdy, skinny professor of Asian philosophy who couldn’t hold a conversation to save his life, David is now director of Aura Transformation Corp., and a world renowned dating and life coach. Dr. Tian has been featured in international media, including AXN, Cosmopolitan, Psychology Today, as well as co-hosting a radio show on national radio and a weekly dating advice column in a national newspaper in Singapore. Formerly a professor at the National University of Singapore, Dr. Tian is actively researching, speaking, and publishing in the areas of philosophy and psychology.
The show, “Man Up: Masculinity for the Intelligent Man,” is David’s way of helping as many people as possible enjoy empowering and fulfilling lives, while contributing to the global understanding of masculinity in modern times. In the show, he takes your questions posed in The Man Up private Facebook group and answers based on his experience Coaching tens of thousands of students around the world for over a decade.
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David Tian: Boom! Stop. I’m David Tian, PhD. And in this video I answer the question: When she doesn’t know how she feels about you. Welcome to Man Up Episode 169.
Masculinity for the Intelligent Man. I’m David Tian, PhD., and this is Man Up!
Hey I’m David Tian, PhD. and for over the past 10 years, I have been helping hundreds of thousands of people in over 87 countries attain success, happiness, and fulfillment in life and love. And here we are in Bali still. This is Jimbaran looking towards the sunset. We got the surf. We got some people surfing. You’ve got the beach. It’s a really nice resort here. It’s called Double Six and nice rooftop. Our lounge here. We’ve got a table, just shooting before we have some drinks.
So, in the private Facebook group for Man Up – by the way you should join that group, click the link, join the group. In the group, Noah asked a question and it’s like a paragraph so I’m going to read most of it.
“Hey guys, so this is my first post and I’m not really sure what to expect. But so, I’ve got this close friend. She’s super smart and hot as fuck: the type of girl who I would totally want to be with. I have a tendency to be into crazy or unstable girls for whatever reason, but this girl isn’t like that.”
Okay, so, let me just pause and it’s better if I just do it interlinear, so to speak.
“I have a tendency to be into crazy or unstable girls for whatever reason.”
Here is the reason: It’s because that’s something that you’re lacking in your own life and you want to have that in yourself. We’re attracted to whatever we don’t have but we want. So, you’d feel like for whatever reasons, you are too hemmed in by your life or your circumstances, and that’s what you’re responding to right now in your life.
A lot of guys who get into pick-up, they suddenly discover that being adventurous and risk-taking is sexy, so they start to get attracted to that energy in the feminine, in the females. And they’re like: Why is my life so full of drama now that I’ve gotten into pick-up?
Well, one of the reasons is because they keep selecting and responding to women who have that part of them as natural parts of them that they don’t have in themselves, the dudes don’t have in themselves, but then they realize that they’re lacking and that they want. And then when they get a little bit of it, it’s like a drug. They get a little bit of that wild lifestyle, and they get addicted to it, but they’re not natural with it yet so they’re still looking for it in other people.
It’s sort of like the fact that I am an intellectual academic for most of my life means that I don’t get as excited about it when I find it in other people. Because first of all, it’s pretty common. Through most of my 20s, I was surrounded with people like that. And secondly, it’s not something that I lack in my life, so I’m not naturally drawn to it on a sexual level. So that’s just an example of how we are drawn sexually, attracted to energies that we lack in our lives but that we want.
The weird thing is if you don’t come to terms with that, that later on when you get into a relationship with that kind of energy, it’s also something you’ve disowned in your past, that if you haven’t come to terms with it, you’ll end up disowning that energy in your partner. It’s a deep, deep concept. I’ve covered this in more detail in a course called Rock Solid Relationships, which I’ve only been teaching live so far for the past few years, and we’re getting ready to release it online.
But anyway, there’s a lot more to be said about that, the disowning of previous energies in yourself. Because what will happen is as you get into a relationship with this type of woman who is crazy and unstable, is anybody who is sane and rational would be like: “That’s a recipe for a bad relationship.” You don’t want to be in a relationship, long-term, committed, exclusive relationship with anybody who is unstable.
But you’ll also be turned off by it later on. Because a part of you, a very strong part of you disowned that in yourself earlier in your life. And unless you come to terms with it, which is like years of almost therapeutic therapy or counseling or really deep psychological reflection and working out of that layer of your life, unless you do that hard work, you’re still going to be reacting to that as you are now.
It seems like you really don’t understand why you’re attracted to that, and you did another throwaway comment. So for the guys who watch Man Up and been following along, you’ll notice that these throwaway comments, the comments that guys who are writing the questions don’t think are a big deal but actually are from an analyst point of view, these are the throwaway comments that tell us everything we need to know, right? So this is another example of a throwaway comment that is very insightful. Moving on, though.
“And she knows I want something more.” Oh wait wait, I’m sorry. “But this girl isn’t like that.” So you have a tendency to be into crazy or unstable girls, but this girl isn’t like that. “We’ve hooked up a few times. Nothing major. Just feeling her up and shit.” This is how dudes talk, right? “And she knows I want something more. I think she feels the same way but she’s expressed to me that she usually fucks up relationships and that she doesn’t want to ruin the friendship.”
You say she’s not crazy and unstable, but the shit you’re saying right now sounds to me like she draws crazy and unstable into her life. So maybe you’re not, in relation to the other crazy and unstable girls you’ve been dating, she’s not crazy and unstable, but she sounds pretty crazy and unstable right now. “But she’s expressed to me that she usually fucks up relationships, and she doesn’t want to ruin this friendship. She also says…”
I had a sip of this Long Island, so I’m a little bit inarticulate right now.
“She also says she doesn’t know how she feels about it, meaning me, yet. I’ve been trying to just be low key and not push it, which I think is the right call, but I want to know if there’s anything else I should or shouldn’t be doing. My goal is to end up dating her. Thanks for reading.”
Okay, I’ll give you the hard truth and then a how to, or like a prescription for what to do next. The hard truth is she’s not attracted to you enough. Look, dude, if Brad Pitt or whoever the hot guy is now, Ryan Gosling or whatever, was her friend and into her, do you think she’d be like: “Hey, you know, I’m not sure. I don’t want to ruin my friendship with Ryan Gosling. I don’t want to take it any further.”
Like, fuck no, dude. She’s going to throw it out. She’s going to just throw out all these plans and go for it. And right now, you’re not turning her on enough for her to just abandon all the shit and go for it, take that risk. So right now, you’re in the friend zone.
So this is one of those situations where unless there is a reason why you’re just friends still, over time, unless you go further with it and progress that relationship, and there’s no other reason, like, no reasons… You need barriers to maintain that friendship and that sexual tension. I’ll give you some examples. If one or both of you are in a relationship, that’s an easy barrier for why you can still be friends and not consummate it sexually but do it later on down the line.
Another one is maybe you’re work colleagues, or maybe there’s a power relationship like teacher-student, or boss-secretary, or something like that, right? There’s got to be some other barrier. If there are no barriers and you don’t hook up, just the magic of time is, that that time itself kills the tension. That’s what happened here, I suspect. Even though you kind of felt each other up, even though you’ve felt each other up, because you weren’t able to progress any further and you’re like, okay no? Time itself disintegrates the sexual tension.
I don’t know how long ago this was when you guys were feeling each other up and stuff, but it’s still salvageable if that’s the case, if it wasn’t too long ago. “My goal is to end up dating her. Thanks for reading. I want to know if there’s anything else that I should or shouldn’t be doing.”
Okay. So, if you actually want to progress this further, you’ve got to consider yourself as being in the friend zone but it’s not ruined yet. Now, you actually have to step up. So, you’re like: “I don’t want to push it. I’ll wait until she makes a decision.” That’s not a masculine rule, alright? You don’t want to pressure her in a sense of like, “Make a decision, bitch.”
But then again, you do need to lead. You need to lead. You can’t be laid back and let her lead. So you need to take that initiative and move things forward. And this could just mean there are lots of ways of escalating the relationship. You could do it physically by just pushing it further than just feeling her up so to speak. You could, you know… I don’t need to explain what that is, but progress further physically. You could progress further verbally. Tell her more about what you like about her. So, appreciate her verbally. Tell her explicitly the things about her personality that you appreciate.
So she knows in her conscious and unconscious mind why you like her. Okay, that’s an important part. It’s not just her body. It’s not just in the moment because you’re drunk or whatever, but that there’s a reason for it. And you can also progress it verbally in terms of connection; connecting deeper on an emotional level. And you can also progress it further in terms of your social circles. That’s another way of progressing it further.
There’s another way of progressing it further, is in terms of relationship patterns. You could go grocery shopping and cooking together. That’s something that couples usually do. You could go on trips together: vacations, go on holidays together. That’s something that couples do as well. That’s progressing the relationship.
There are lots of ways of escalating the relationship or progressing the relationship that you need to do now. You need to take the leadership role and move it forward. It’s her job as a woman to say: “Oh, no. This is my comfort zone. That’s as far as I’ll go and no further”, right?
Right now, you’re in limbo. You’re in purgatory. You don’t really know if it’s in or not. So you have to push it to find out where that limit is, and then here’s a secret, take it one little step further. That’s the leadership role. You take it to where her comfort zone is, and then see if she will follow you out of that comfort zone into the next stage.
Because right now, she says she doesn’t want to risk the friendship shit or she doesn’t want to risk anything. That’s a very dangerous place for you to be in. Because if she doesn’t want to risk it, then the natural thing to do is to stay there. She’s going to stay there forever. There’s no reason right now for her to leave the friend zone with you. She’s got everything she wants with you right now: make out when you’re drunk and shit and then get all the comfort of having friends.
So, if you want something more, you’re going to have to push it further and force her to a point of decision. Yes or no. Otherwise, you’re a pussy. She’s not going to respect that shit. So many guys are so feminized right now because of the politically correct bullshit culture, that they’re too afraid to step up and progress and lead. So there’s your how to, but right now you don’t think you’re in the friend zone. You’re in the fucking friend zone.
Well, you’re not in dead friend zone, like it’s, “Fuck it forever”, and you’ve got to like disappear, but you’re definitely over the line in friend zone, but you’re closer to the border. So you can still get out. Alright, so there you go.
I got to get to these drinks. My throat’s getting parched. The food is getting cold. Going to hit that. Here’s the sun’s beautiful sunset. I’ll leave you with that. The sunlight over the water is just a beautiful thing. Beautiful sunsets in Bali. And join the private Facebook group. You can see Noah’s question there. There’s a good comment thread in there and I pick questions from the private Facebook group, and I interact personally with the guys in there.
So, I’ll see you in the private Facebook group.
Click the link, join the group. I’ll see you inside the group.
Until then, Man Up!